Bring back Kill Permissions *NOT CLICKBAIT*

[Infi]

DISCLAIMER: I highly advise you read the FULL THREAD before making your reply. Thank you!

IGN: oInfi
DATE: 9/30/22
WHAT YOU WANT TO SUGGEST OR MENTION:
Bring back obtainable kill permissions, however make them extremely hard to obtain.
HOW WILL THIS BENEFIT THE SERVER/COMMUNITY?:

Controversial, but after playing SRP with the new consented permissions system, I suggest the removal of consented kill permissions. I believe to calm down the criminal world, kill permissions should not have been so easily obtainable. However I also believe that the permissions should not have been taken away from the community and forced players to have to consent for them. When the permissions became consented, the risk factor to the game and to the character was near eliminated. You can go to the hospital and get fully functional prosthetic limbs, tongues, voice boxes and more with the “advanced” hospital staff that Karakura has in their lore. Hence making characters unkillable or out of commission unless you are to kill them via consented permissions. Now, though the permissions should be returned in order to bring back the risk that not only you but your character feel whilst playing the game, it should be brought back with great caution. I believe that the permissions should be added back and obtainable, however they should be EXTREMELY hard to obtain. I will provide a list of the only four ways you may obtain kill permissions below:

Hitman: Upon asking an individual to kill another player, the player who was asked to be killed may carry out kill permissions on the player who was attempting to hire you.

- Example: If Hitoro Akihito asks Kiyoko Akai to kill Valentinus Wayne, and Kiyoko tells Valentinus that Hiroto asked her to kill him, then Valentinus gets KPS on Hiroto.

Major Permissions: Should your character get a vital body part (arm, leg, eye, tongue, etc) removed, you may carry out kill permissions on the character that majored you. This does not include minor limbs (i.e. toes, fingers, hands, feet, carvings, etc)

Kidnapping: Should your character get kidnapped AND brought to an undisclosed location, you may act on kill permissions. If they fail to bring you to a location, or you get down and run away, the permissions are not valid. (View Yonio's reply in regards to a second opinion on this.)

Consented: All consented KPS rules apply here.

Finally, rather than a ten OOC minute bleedout timer, I suggest raising it to 15 minutes. I believe that these all applied will make GangRP more active, still roleplay oriented, return the risk that so many people miss, yet still apply realism and struggle to the game whereas people still die, just not near as often as the broken KPS system allowed.

Additional notes:
I simply want to know what everyone thinks on the matter.

THIS IS NOT COMPLETELY BRINGING BACK KPS. IT'S BRINGING IT BACK BUT WITH EXTREME CAUTION AND STRICTER RULES

 

[ReverendDubs]

+1
I need to get bounties somehow for my bounty hunter business

 

[HighlightedTwin]

Yes +1

 

[Kana]

-1

I am tired of answering suggestions for some reason, but I felt this specific one needed my opinion. Hebwig fought hard to make the kill perms change; from my perspective, it has only improved GangRP. No longer are people scared that 10 people kill them in ballistic masks surrounding them, they actually get to play their character the way their character is written without fearing if the said character will be alive tomorrow. Perma death is heavily frowned upon in other roleplaying communities, let's hold ourselves to a higher standard. There have been MANY cases where kill perms were consented. Of course, I understand the want for more risk, but how about we focus on adding risks outside of character deaths? Make the police crackdown more, more evidence left at crime scenes, make it so that GANGS have kill perms on their members. Remove advanced technology, such as the eye transplants you mentioned. Have prosthetics have to be approved by staff members via forums applications (like they used to be).

I can see this doing the pro of bringing more risk, but it'll also bring the con of making people scared to roleplay the characters that THEY wrote. Characters are the property of the writer, only the writer should decide when their character dies.

 

[jacko]

+1
based

 

[Iris.fi]

-1 100% agreed with everything Kana said. I'm afraid if kill perms will be brought back, it'll turn into killing just for the sake of it without actual writing leading up to it etc, which pretty much kills the idea of a roleplay server, too lazy to write the same points Kana has already said

 

[Prizebox]

I would prefer for majoring such as cutting an arm or leg have more consequences than simply going to EMS and bam, good as new, like nothing happened, ready to run a marathon; But since a way to moderate who has been majored is difficult for staff, I'd say during a kidnap your character should be allowed to kill thier kidnapper, since they're in a possible life or death situation, same for someone being held hostage.

 

[Nylu]

+1/-1

The addition of consented KPS has been a bit iffy. What Heb tried to accomplish worked before people resorted to only target eyes because blinding a character puts them out of commission. With the lore that prosthetics have, majoring another character simply accomplishes nothing since people don't tend to actually roleplay out pain and emotion when losing an actual limb. When my characters lose a limb, I have them realistically roleplay the recovery. If we used logic, your character couldn't get a prosthetic immediately after getting a limb removed because the spot would need to heal and people seem to skiprp (which I personally think should be consented by who did the major) that whole factor.

However, the removal of KPS was to help characters retain lore and remove the possibility that everything they gained goes down the drain. I do agree that it's part of the risk but to me, it's so convoluted that I can't find my way of putting it into words so I'm going to reference what Heb said.

"Inevitably, some would no longer take the path of GangRP because their motives of being involved purely lie around killing other people’s characters — and, this is a good thing. To allow players, who do not care for the writing and creativity aspect that GangRP should be delving into more frequently, to fizzle out from this part of the community, we automatically benefit. In turn, players who prioritize writing quality and uniquely intricate roleplay may involve themselves in GangRP!" - Hebwig (FEEDBACK | KILL PERMISSIONS RE-EVALUATION)

This didn't work in Heb's favor whatsoever. People within the crime faction found other ways to permanently remove a character and refused to prioritize actual roleplay and writing quality. I think what Heb tried was to get people in the crime faction to actually push themselves into interesting roleplay but as an active member of the crime faction, this didn't help the faction at all. People care about majors the same way they cared about KPS and the confusion that was meant to be removed remained. If anything, people who did GangRP devolved.

-1 100% agreed with everything Kana said. I'm afraid if kill perms will be brought back, it'll turn into killing just for the sake of it without actual writing leading up to it etc, which pretty much kills the idea of a roleplay server, too lazy to write the same points Kana has already said

Ever since the addition of this rule, it seems that the killing just for the sake of it was replaced with majoring for the sake of it. I personally see no difference other than losing your character permanently.

However, one thing that Heb tried does seem to be working.

"As aforementioned, forced & permanent character death would not be as rampant. This benefits everybody, as nobody likes when their character dies, and it would give people more time to fully flesh out their characters and allow them to flourish, regardless of what path they choose to take." - Hebwig (FEEDBACK | KILL PERMISSIONS RE-EVALUATION)

There are still people who have decided to favor roleplay with the addition of this rule. This is allowing characters to develop instead. Many people who relied so heavily on KPS have also left the community, allowing the rest to actually engage in captivating roleplay that leaves them wanting to return but that's what I've noticed.

Despite everything said, I think I'll remain to lean more toward keeping KPS consented. Roleplay is better than senseless kps just for the sake of it!

To keep majors impactful, maybe the option to skiprp injuries should ONLY be allowed if the person who did the major consents the person to do so. This would force players to actually roleplay situations instead of acting like it never happened.

(I couldn't express my thoughts on this so I might end up coming back and editing this later on)

 

[Yonio]

+1/-1

I do have to admit that, although the introduction of consented KPS was indeed beneficial, removing 95% of the instances where someone would get KPS was certainly not a very considerate decision. There are some points that I agree and disagree with. The two instances where I think KPS should be granted (from this feedback post) are the following:

- Major Assault Perms: I feel like if you're engaged enough to cut someone's limb off with a weapon after they were knocked out, you should be able to kill them, considering they inflicted permanent damage on your character

- Hitman: I feel like this should be a rule that applies to all permissions. If I pass Minor Assault Perms on player X to Player Y, player X will get minors on me. Same goes with majors and KPS

However, I do not think that kidnapping should grant automatic KPS, as it is somewhat ambiguous and it's quite hard to word. If you're going out of your way to kidnap someone for a long period of time, I believe that the person doing this will have no inconveniences in consenting to KPS, considering that the people that this feedback post is addressing are the type of roleplayers who would simply take off the limb, mug 5k and leave for the sake of activity rather than roleplay


Don't get me wrong; removing things such as Snitching, Assault with a Weapon, and other reasons that used to result in KPS was one of the best decisions ever made, but the proposals above could be helpful to increase the amount of GangRP activity without having to involve people who are not interested in it.

 

[cho0ii]

-1

Literally everything Kana said honest to God

 

[Nova]

- 1

honestly, its not realistic for someone to just go ahead and decide to kill someone for petty reasons (and if your only rebuttal to that statement is being a serial killer or being mentally ill, one, serial killers have motives and two, mentally ill people don't just??? go around??? starting stuff so they could kill them later???? same could still be said about fracturing someone's bones with minor permissions.. But then again, there are some bad things that could be done that give minor perms. That being said, why don't those extremely bad things give major perms instead of getting your arms broken for saying a little insult.

none the less, the way KPS are working now is completely fine as it is. Everything is far less toxic than it used to be and it doesn't need to get any more toxic.

I sort of do agree with what Yonio said. MOSTLY for the last part. This is SchoolRP and not everyone wants to get involved with GangRP. my character and his friends already face enough trauma from that typa shit an they do be just tryna live their lives man.

 

[ImYourManMyles]

+1/-1
IM SO UNDECISIVE WHEN IT COMES TO THIS. I WANT IT BACK, BUT IM SO USED TO THIS NEW RULE NOW. But I lowkey kinda miss it…

 

[jacko]

+1/-1
IM SO UNDECISIVE WHEN IT COMES TO THIS. I WANT IT BACK, BUT IM SO USED TO THIS NEW RULE NOW. But I lowkey kinda miss it…

based

 

[ImYourGirlAubrey]

+1/-1
hebwig did work EXTREMELY hard to make the “removal” of kps actually happen, and i do think it was a great decision but at the same time honestly people have kinda been throwing around major perms like it’s nothing because they know they can just decline kps..
i like the idea to make it much harder to obtain the permissions because then people can hopefully still gangrp w/o being terrified of losing their characters — but at the same time ppl need to know that it is gonna come with risks and that’s kinda just apart of srp atp. but yah idk i think it works well how it is now but yk

 

[Infi]

For the people worried about losing their characters to GangRP when they do not wish to GangRP, the refined rules and methods of obtaining kill permissions would make it impossible to get your character killed by just getting caught in a situation.

Also note this: You must have an EXTREMELY good reason for killing someone via kill permissions. So this would also avoid baseless killing with no lore.

 

[Yonio]

Quick reminder that this feedback doesn't aim to fully re-instate the old system of KPS. All it's suggesting (in a nutshell) is for KPS to be brought back if someone acts on the full extent of Major Assault Perms. Things such as snitching, assault with blunt weapons, arrests, and other old KPS-granting situations will not be reinstated since they often resulted in situations that didn't make that much sense

 

[NoZinth]

That is true, but there have been more than multiple ways the system has failed to show that there is a good reason to kill someone. Plus, isn't it still possible to kill someone after being snitched on and locked up? Isn't it still possible to get KPS from someone if they attempt to break into your home?

Plus Karakura is based in Japan, the crime isn't even supposed to be as heavy as it is in Detroit, and even without KPS it still does feel like Detroit bro

With both the current system & the new system being suggested by oInfi, both instances you listed here don't give KPS. I'd refer you to take a look at rule 9.6 with it's subsections to clarify the current KPS rules :D

 

[Nova]

mmmmm

yeah it's gonna be a +1 / -1 hearing it properly clarified by Yonio.

It does seem very fair for KPS to really be given when MPS are fully acted upon. this is actually a pretty decent suggestion.

 

[jacko]

With both the current system & the new system being suggested by oInfi, both instances you listed here don't give KPS. I'd refer you to take a look at rule 9.6 with it's subsections to clarify the current KPS rules :D

you said peanuts without the t and i have a clip lol

 

[Aidanator14]

-1
So for the suggestion proposed I get that people want kill permissions to be obtainable again but the reason I want to know is why? Since its removal I have had so much more fun with players gangrping, within Akihito clan yes but also random players in other gangs that before KPS was removed would only be interested in trying to use perms on me, but yet since this rule chance was made by hebwig I know for a fact that within my roleplaying it is much more enjoyable. Players are able to "GangRP" without getting killed, the quotations are for instances like delinquent gangs, that want to experience criminal roleplay however they don't run around with murder as a sole purpose and therefore it allows them to come onto the scene and roleplay properly without limitations because of other "perm hungry" gangs that once dominated SRP.

In my own opinion as a player that's been on this server for a great number of years, I have played through all 3 maps and gangrped on the 2nd and the 3rd (Current map) I have been through a large majority of different "era's" of gangrp as people will call them, Kage, Bashkimi, Owari, ZT, Miyagi, Mondai, Bakuto, Akihito and many more gangs between. A very large gang at one point being Ghost 2.0, more commonly just referred to as Ghost was lead by CarnageRP (@CarnageRP) and myself, and yeah during the time leading this gang was fun, we got to a point where we had so many members and weapons that literally no gang could oppose us and yes I am one of the very hated gangrpers that i am talking about, During the days of Ghost, ZT and Miyagi all GangRP was, was perms, that's all that mattered to everyone involved, how many kills and how many weapons they had. However now Gangrping/criminalrping without killing and majoring people it is far more enjoyable for all parties involved.

Kill permissions being removed from the server at first may have seemed very big and "oh wow" however its really not that big of a surprise, many other roleplay servers (I wont name them here) only have consented Kill permissions because they value the roleplay above running around and killing someone with a longsword or katana. In my own opinion I believe that while on SRP which is a RP server, roleplay should be the number one priority and should be valued above everything else, players should be able to have fun and take part in ALL aspects of roleplay without being limited out of fear of their character dying. I have been there, done that and got the T-Shirt (RIP Enzo gbnf) but there is nothing worst than creating lore, making biography's and such for characters that then because of one wrong move cannot play that character.
​

I can see this doing the pro of bringing more risk, but it'll also bring the con of making people scared to roleplay the characters that THEY wrote. Characters are the property of the writer, only the writer should decide when their character dies.

The above statement which kana said I agree with 100%, why should some random player have the ability to kill off a character that may have been on the server for 1, 2 maybe even 3 years? All that lore down the drain due to someone that just wants a ss of you doing /lay on the floor for their public activity??

Ill say what I always say, wanna make a gang and go around killing people? download GTAworld or FiveM and go shoot at people, people are on SchoolRP to roleplay and have fun while doing it. SchoolRP is a place where people should be able to make a character and roleplay how they see fit with said character that they have created, they shouldn't have to limit themselves due to the fear of losing their hard earned character.​