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Student Council and School Prefect Reform

Should this suggestion be implemented?


  • Total voters
    58

philbertman42

Level 146
philbertman42
philbertman42
Notable
Student Council and School Prefect Reform
A new role has been implemented into the school, that being the "Prefect." Comprised of model students, the prefects act as "hall monitors" who report any instances of rule breaking to higher authorities. I believe prefects are a good addition to the student faction, but there is unused potential that could improve not only the prefects, but the existing student council as well. And with that said, there are a few issues I see with this role as it currently stands:​

The responsibility of the prefect, that being monitoring school grounds, is already covered by the council and school faculty; there aren't enough delinquents on your average day to justify introducing another role which patrols the school. In addition to this, Prefects have no FearRP authority, meaning they cannot do anything about delinquent students on their own. If a prefect collects evidence of the student doing something wrong, there is nothing stopping that student from just assaulting the prefect and destroying the evidence.​

In the other corner of the student faction, the student council has been facing issues as of late. Particularly, we are lacking in the "events" and "assisting students" departments, which makes up half of our responsibilities. We do keep ourselves busy with disciplinary affairs and by helping with events larger than us, but that comes at the cost of our initial goal, which was to improve the general school experience.​

The Solution? Delegate the council's disciplinary responsibilities to the prefects, and more clearly define what both groups' objectives are. By doing this, you allow for both factions to perform their duties to a higher degree; the student council will be able to focus on improving the school and hosting events, while the school prefects can take over on any disciplinary affairs. Below is a proposal for what each groups primary mission and supplementary tasks should be.​
Updated
Responsibilities
Student Council

The student council's tasks will be​
geared more towards assisting players​
and providing more for them to do​
on a day to day basis, rather than​
being focused primarily on​
disciplinary roleplay.​
Assist any student who needs help

Help supervise during classes and events

Monitor sports practices and club meetings

Host large-scale server wide events

Host small flash events or small activities in the council room
School Prefects

Prefects will be concerned with anything​
and everything related to disciplinary​
action, such as issuing and​
monitoring detentions.​
Patrol the school campus

Handle any disciplinary affairs within the school

Provide basic counseling for troubled students

Compile reports on persistently delinquent students

As an alternative to my main suggestion, here is a proposal I made for the student council in December of last year, which was never expanded on by the council higher-ups. In it, I suggest the addition of "committees" to the council, which similarly aims to solve the issues of our current council not delegating enough resources to its many responsibilities. (I also used it as a baseline for this suggestion if that's not obvious lol.)

Personally, I think that even with my prior suggestions, the council and prefects are just different flavors of the same thing, and are pretty hard to distinguish between. It would be more convenient for everybody if they operated under one role, since there would be no confusion as to which student group does what thing. But at the same time, prefects are still a new thing and I'm not so brazen as to suggest getting rid of it within one day of it existing.

Regardless of whether or not the proposal outlined in this document is used, I hope it might inspire ideas for our current factions or at least provide insight as to how we might improve them.

Realistically, prefects / the student council wouldn't do these things.
SRP is a roleplay, which is an emulation of reality, not a perfect reflection. There are many aspects of SRP that don't make sense if you think too hard about it, and it's like that by design. Not everything needs to be realistic, if it was then playing the server would be no different than going to actual real life school every day (and nobody wants to come home from a long day of work / school just to do more work).

The general consensus is, as long as something contributes to making the server more enjoyable and makes just enough sense to be believable, then it's fair game to implement it. I think everything I suggested meets the criteria.

The council is already doing well with events.
In the past 6 months, there have been two major events which involved the student council, and a handful of minor flash events. In my opinion, the council thinks too hard over small-scale events, which is why they happen as infrequently as they do. I think we could realistically be doing small flash events on a weekly basis, if not more. If you look at the teaching factions, you'll see two rosters full of individual people that are expected to hold 20 minute activities at least 10 times in the span of a month. Is it so unrealistic to say that the council, a group of a dozen people, could easily do at least one activity per week? We don't even have to be restricted to subject matter, like the teaching factions are.

Back when Lara (the former HS President) was around, she'd plan games out 30 minutes in advance and announce it like it was a class. She just did this whenever she was bored, too; there was never any drawn out process, just a notification in council chat that she's doing something soon and that anyone is welcome to help. This is the way we should be doing it, just a casual fun thing, rather than planning something out weeks in advance for the sake of a 30 minute activity.

In regards to large-scale server events, I think we're doing mostly fine. It's cool that the council does get involved with larger events every now and then, but we have an OOC event team to handle the bulk of them.

Council isn't FearRPd until SLT is mentioned. Councilors are assaulted too.
The council has identical FearRP to the faculty, according to Rule 5.6A. You follow the 3 warning rule (described in this official guide), after which they must FearRP or it is considered FailRP. Delinquent students don't get any perms on councilors for doing their job, so it is entirely the councilor's decision whether they allow their character to be assaulted or not.

People will stop applying for council if you take away what it is known for.
This is half correct. People who want to do disciplinary roleplay with delinquents will stop applying for council, and would instead would try to become a prefect. Assuming the council adopts more responsibilities to replace what they've lost, there would be plenty of new reason for players to apply for the student council. Don't think of it as the council losing its identity, but rather as the council changing its identity. The council wouldn't lose anything, it would just be shifting its focus onto different things.

Prefects are meant to be "this," council is meant to be "that."
Prefects are meant to be hall monitors, in addition to acting as model students; I am aware of this fact, but the reason I made this suggestion was because I wanted to change things. I think prefects could contribute more to the server than just being good students and reporting bad ones, which is why I am suggesting they should be given more authority.

Additionally, I know and understand all the current responsibilities and limits of the student council, since I've been a part of it for over two years; my goal here is to change that, in the hopes it will provide more unique roleplay opportunities for councilors that otherwise aren't done at the moment.

"This" faction already does "that" thing, that would create overlap.
In regards to my usage of the word "counselling," I am aware that there are official school counsellors, and I am not saying that students take over this role; rather, I am saying that prefects could offer advice to delinquent students as part of their discipline, based on whatever might be causing the poor behavior. It's something I'll usually do myself if I can get some alone time with somebody in detention and they're willing to roleplay, it's pretty cool and fun (and way more meaningful than giving them a pre-made detention task).

Tutors are able to assist teachers, but it isn't something they have to do; even if that wasn't the case, there are only four slots for tutors, meaning the overlap between councilors and tutors would be minimal regardless.
In case it's brought up, I don't consider the one to three random faculty friends of the teacher loitering around in the room to be assistants. An assistant actively contributes to the activity, whereas the people I'm describing usually just show up because they're bored.

It is unlikely that councilors could do the type of roleplay you described.
I think my weakest argument is that they could attend sports practice, and looking back I agree that it isn't a good idea; sports practices are mostly OOC (other than track, swim, and cheer), so participating in them would basically just be watching people play the sports plugin for an hour or so without doing anything else.

Other than that however, I could see every other thing I've described happening on a regular basis.

Assisting in classes is something that regular students can already do, they just don't gain any authorities that faculty have and can't do 100% of the teacher's job for them. I don't think it would be unrealistic for this to become one of the council's tasks, as it's beneficial to the teacher and gives councilors something cool to lord over the common folk.

Attending club meetings would be 100% doable, as club meetings are usually more grounded in roleplay. Regardless of anyone's opinions on the current state of the club faction and their overall activity, having councilors interact with clubs is just a great way to get roleplay going between different groups, and a great way to check in with clubs ICly on a regular basis.

"Helping students" is very vague, which was deliberate on my part; the act of helping students could vary between a million things, and there is a broad range of things which could be considered "helping students." Looking back, I wasn't clear enough; I'm not suggesting councilors run around campus to look for students that might need help, I'm saying that the council should come up with things to do which help students who might need it.
It might seem like a cop-out, but I'd rather not get into discussing every idea I have for what constitutes as "helping students." When initially creating the thread, I thought including a large section to suggest ideas for this would detract from my main idea, and I still believe this is true. Regardless, I think it would be better as a topic for discussion in one of the council's meetings, rather than in a public forum post.

Prefects shouldn't exist / Prefects should become a branch of council.
Yeah, I agree. I said it in my original post, the responsibilities of the prefect role are already being covered by the council and school faculty. This is why I included my proposal for council committees that I made six months ago, because implementing it would allow for the council to have people who are dedicated to specific tasks, rather than having a group of people that just do whatever they want as long as it's vaguely council-like. In other words, people would have concrete goals to work towards, and if we went as far as introducing quotas (like every other faction in the server), things would get actually done and our activity would skyrocket. The role of "prefect" would be covered by the "disciplinary committee," who would essentially do what our prefects do now, plus what I suggested for them in this thread.

The reason this isn't my main suggestion is because I don't think it's completely impossible for prefects and the council to exist separately, and also because prefects are a very new role. I do think there is benefit in having prefects be their own separate thing, and outright shutting it down because it has a rough start would be a bit much.

If you told me which option I would prefer, it would be to keep everything as part of the council, and give prefects their own dedicated responsibilities within the council (like I listed in my proposal document).


 
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Arocatula

Level 198
Arocatula
Arocatula
Rich+
I've already witnessed some immature actions from some prefects, mainly centered around them having fights both physically and verbally. I think once we have either new prefects or generally making our current ones more well-behaved I would like to see something like this because, at the moment, some don't seem to prove that they can handle disciplinary affairs compared to councillors.
 

wethecreature

Level 109
wethecreature
wethecreature
Rich
I've already witnessed some immature actions from some prefects, mainly centered around them having fights both physically and verbally. I think once we have either new prefects or generally making our current ones more well-behaved I would like to see something like this because, at the moment, some don't seem to prove that they can handle disciplinary affairs compared to councillors.
I feel like this will change since ofc this is a very new thing. people need to get used to it and understand the true responsibilities of the rule and repercussions of using it wrong.
 

Joe.exe

Level 53
Joe_Kurumi
Joe_Kurumi
Rich+
-1
Sorry, I'm opposed to this.

After Mxxkie left the Council last spring and the collective resignation of College Councilor in the summer, the Council needs reform, but I prefer School Prefects and Council to work together, more like two responsibilities.

Believe me, a "Judgement" that specializes in managing discipline in the game will make people feel boring. I have been a Councilor for 2 years, so I know how it feels.
reason:
It doesn't have as much fun as the other positions, all you do is patrol and put a stop to it, you might say, it's similar to the police faction, but sorry, that's not the same, the police faction does the whole Karakura crime thing Confrontation has more uncertainty and excitement, and schools in the safe zone lose this most important point.
This leads to a rapid decline in enthusiasm for the person in the position until they leave.

Putting discipline under the management of the Council will keep the Council from being idle during normal times, and the activities held by the Council can continue the Council's enthusiasm, so I think the status quo should be maintained.

I will quote you next:
1.
Assist any student who needs help
In a role-playing school, it's hard to find anyone who needs help.
You mean maybe someone who was beaten to the ground? That's probably what you think School Prefects does:
Patrol the school campus

2.
Help supervise during classes and events
Supervise classes and events?
In a classroom, the only thing worthy of supervision is discipline, but you have taken that responsibility away from the Councillor's purview.
In an event, it is always the organizer of the event who supervises and arranges its holding. abourt discipline, you have taken this responsibility away from the Councillor's authority.
Handle any disciplinary affairs within the school

3.
Monitor sports practices and club meetings
Same as Article 2

Your idea of splitting the power of the Council in two will not make it strong, it will only destroy the Council. Once this idea is put into practice, I think it will attract opposition from the Councillor and the President.

All that said, I'm against this idea.
Thank you for reading.
 

philbertman42

Level 146
philbertman42
philbertman42
Notable
Thread starter
Believe me, a "Judgement" that specializes in managing discipline in the game will make people feel boring. I have been a Councilor for 2 years, so I know how it feels.
reason:
It doesn't have as much fun as the other positions, all you do is patrol and put a stop to it, you might say, it's similar to the police faction, but sorry, that's not the same, the police faction does the whole Karakura crime thing Confrontation has more uncertainty and excitement, and schools in the safe zone lose this most important point.
This leads to a rapid decline in enthusiasm for the person in the position until they leave.
As of right now, disciplinary roleplay is the bulk of what the council does (outside of events, or when individuals choose to contribute in other ways on their own). That said, it would be inaccurate to say that it's objectively boring. I agree that some people can certainly make it boring, but is more to it than you've described. Discipline doesn't have to be hunting students down, sitting them in the detention room, and silently watching them as they do homework. You could try interacting with or counselling the students, to see if something's up that's causing their behavior. You're not going to "fix" anyone with just one conversation, but if the student is willing to work with you it can make for some interesting roleplay regardless.

I won't go as far as saying that it's the best thing ever, because sometimes it does suck. People can be difficult OOCly, either by being unrealistically uncooperative ICly or just FailRPing. It's definitely not the type of thing for everyone, and that's okay.

In a role-playing school, it's hard to find anyone who needs help.
There are new players wandering around all the time that could probably use some in-character help to get a decent foothold on the school aspect of the server. It wouldn't be difficult to occasionally fun little seminars in the council room to get them accustomed to roleplay. Helping people doesn't just mean helping when somebody is breaking the rules, it applies to little things, to.

In a classroom, the only thing worthy of supervision is discipline, but you have taken that responsibility away from the Councillor's purview.
In an event, it is always the organizer of the event who supervises and arranges its holding. abourt discipline, you have taken this responsibility away from the Councillor's authority.
Supervision does not equal discipline, discipline is just one aspect of supervision. To supervise is to observe. Watching the students to make sure they're behaving or to help them if they are struggling is certainly a part of that, but it could also mean a lot more; the council could be watching the teacher as well, to make sure nobody's being domed in the skull with a collapsible metal chair. It could mean going around events, helping out if something goes wrong. It could mean getting involved with club and sports meetings, to ensure they are doing what they're meant to or just getting involved. And in all of these cases, there is opportunity for you to roleplay and interact with other people. Is one of these people being naughty? Talk to them, see what's up, and compile an official report if necessary.

Your idea of splitting the power of the Council in two will not make it strong, it will only destroy the Council.
I wouldn't go as far as saying it will "destroy" the council, but I agree that it could make things more difficult, at least initially. Personally, I would prefer this proposal instead (which I didn't know the link for was broken in the original post, damn you SRP forum filter), as then we would have the functionality of both, all under one role, while still maintaining individual focus on each important aspect of the faction. The reason I didn't outright suggest them to "remove prefects, my idea is better" is because it has been just a few days, and we haven't seen much from them. Things could get better for them, we don't know.

That said, assuming the council and prefects stay separate, I think the pros of re-evaluating what the council is and giving the disciplinary related tasks to the prefects will outweigh the cons. It will give prefects more to do than be hall monitors and tattletales, and it will allow the council to focus their efforts on contributing to the school experience.
 

maraa

Level 218
jvllyfsh
jvllyfsh
Omega
I've already witnessed some immature actions from some prefects, mainly centered around them having fights both physically and verbally. I think once we have either new prefects or generally making our current ones more well-behaved I would like to see something like this because, at the moment, some don't seem to prove that they can handle disciplinary affairs compared to councillors.
some prefects or one? because I know what fights you're speaking about, which were carried out by one prefect and one prefect alone. (I was there when the fights started).

Kimi told them that they were to not get physical with students icly, even though the person who fought with the prefect threw the first punch, the prefect shouldn't have entertained it, multiple times at that. I do agree it was immature, but those fights were started/entertained by one person.

Icly I do know prefects and have been with them as they went around the school doing what they were to do, taking the role they were given seriously.
 

Arocatula

Level 198
Arocatula
Arocatula
Rich+
some prefects or one? because I know what fights you're speaking about, which were carried out by one prefect and one prefect alone. (I was there when the fights started).

Kimi told them that they were to not get physical with students icly, even though the person who fought with the prefect threw the first punch, the prefect shouldn't have entertained it, multiple times at that. I do agree it was immature, but those fights were started/entertained by one person.

Icly I do know prefects and have been with them as they went around the school doing what they were to do, taking the role they were given seriously.
It's not just focused on physical fights, it also comes down to how they verbally interact with fellow prefects or the students around them, which according to what I've seen on some pictures, hasn't been the best.

Keep in mind this isn't just one prefect, this is quite a few, and though prefects are more than definitely going to be involved in drama as hall monitors, some tend to not take the situation seriously and act immature, most of the time making it worse. Again, this isn't just one prefect nor is it also them.

I think overall if we just wait for prefects to act more mature, specifically towards physical fighting an fighting through words, believe me, I would like to see something like this suggestion. For now on the other hand, I think it's best to wait off of what I've seen from prefects both firsthand and pictures of situations which hasn't proven to be the best.
 

sei5o

Level 1
I've already witnessed some immature actions from some prefects, mainly centered around them having fights both physically and verbally. I think once we have either new prefects or generally making our current ones more well-behaved I would like to see something like this because, at the moment, some don't seem to prove that they can handle disciplinary affairs compared to councillors.
like wethecreature and maraa already said, the role 'Prefect' is fairly new addition to the school, and from what i've seen; only one out of the four/five members that were selected have acted out in [a misbehaving] manner on school grounds T_T a generalization for that is not accurate at alllll..! if you want a prefect to act as they are "supposed to", then talk to them about their actions like any other student .... i don't think this is such a major deal since you're referencing only one prefect
 

maraa

Level 218
jvllyfsh
jvllyfsh
Omega
like wethecreature and maraa already said, the role 'Prefect' is fairly new addition to the school, and from what i've seen; only one out of the four/five members that were selected have acted out in [a misbehaving] manner on school grounds T_T a generalization for that is not accurate at alllll..! if you want a prefect to act as they are "supposed to", then talk to them about their actions like any other student .... i don't think this is such a major deal since you're referencing only one prefect
thank you user sei5o, i don't really wish to repeat that it's only been one out of the very little group that have been acting out, physically or verbally. that was still one prefect out of the 5 that have been selected.


regardless, this is an easy +1 from me
 
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Arocatula

Level 198
Arocatula
Arocatula
Rich+
I feel like this will change since ofc this is a very new thing. people need to get used to it and understand the true responsibilities of the rule and repercussions of using it wrong.
I do understand that, considering most factions do have mental developing times where prefects have to learn how to be responsible with their role which will definitely improve later compared to now. I would like to see some capabilities change between Council and Prefects overall once we do see improvement happen.
like wethecreature and maraa already said, the role 'Prefect' is fairly new addition to the school, and from what i've seen; only one out of the four/five members that were selected have acted out in [a misbehaving] manner on school grounds T_T a generalization for that is not accurate at alllll..! if you want a prefect to act as they are "supposed to", then talk to them about their actions like any other student .... i don't think this is such a major deal since you're referencing only one prefect
I myself have seen multiple scenarios of prefects misbehaving, which is definitely not centered towards one. This is what I've seen off of pictures and multiple firsthand incidents when or when I don't host classes. Again, I do understand that faction changes are prone to happen and not everything starts out perfect.

Regarding talking to prefects about misbehavior, it's more of a hit-or-miss type of thing, where prefects can actually behave better after said talk or misbehave even more which could be occupied by multiple reasons.

Yes, you yourself may have seen few scenarios of prefects doing such, but I have seen multiple scenarios firsthand and secondhand, including multiple fight incidents which some prefects right now don't seem to be taking it responsibly.

I am just saying (which I don't believe I was heard of the last 2 times I said it) that I would like to see the ability of prefects to have disciplinary affairs with other students similar to what we have with councillors right now. As of our current spot in behavior of prefects overall, I think it's best to wait at least a little bit for improvement even if it's just from "one prefect".

Who knows regardless, by the time Kimi responds to this suggestion behaviors may have improved, which then I would love to see the new faction gain the ability to give discipline to other students while being able to help with detentions and all that jazz.
 

sei5o

Level 1
+ 1
iiii reallly enjoy this idea!! being referred to as a temu councillor is diabolical .. however, given that the prefect is a reaaaally new concept to SRP, i'm sure revision will happen sooner than later regardless! awesome suggestion philbertman42
 

Leo_14

Level 41
leo_14
leo_14
Omega
-1

As a council personally from irl experience, prefects are students that are role models/the best behaved etc while council deal with student affairs such as behaviour etc, although it would be nice for prefects to gain some privileges I believe that council should still primarily have the role if monitoring and issuing detentions.

as for events etc, we can plan events but it doesn't mean all of them will get approved, along with the fact that events take time planning and along with that they need to be original and not repeated often so that they don't become boring, as of rn we have 3 events being planned and 2 to be carried out within the next month, therefore I believe that event wise we are having no issues.

Furthermore, council isn't focused primarily on disciplinary role-play, although its a part your effective saying to shift it onto prefects and give them the discplinilary role-play, your stated prefects should relate to anything disciplinary, your therefore making the prefect role entirely disciplinary. Council do also help students, this is done via the help desk or just by general asking of questions. For counselling this is also where the counsellor role does come in, there is a whole role dedicated to counselling therefore it isn't needed.

Some things could change, as you said there is no fearrp that stops someone from assaulting a prefect however that is the same for a councillor as council do not get fearrped until slt is mentioned or within detention, therefore I think prefects could have the ability to be fearrped if a report is mentioned etc to prevent the assault on prefects, however councillors do get assaulted too.

personally for me I believe that if this did occur it would massively impact council and possibly result in less people applying to the faction as it strips away the RP ability that council is known for as council is never short of RP in schooltime therefore its a -1 from me as prefects are more of a role model, not a disciplinary type role, where as council deals with student related matters, prefects could gain the ability to be fearrped im not a against that but removing the main part of council I believe is too far as its what the faction is known for and a big part in the factions role-play potential and as to why people apply for it.

prefect can be a branch of council? but what your suggesting practically removes the council of its rp potential and is basically eliminating the main thing the council does. You would possibly be practically be killing off the faction as little people apply for the faction to begin with, and if what you suggest did happen even less people would apply than what already do

In conclusion, I think that prefect could become a branch of council or gain a little more power like the ability to be fearrped however what your suggesting like I said before, it will be basically taking the big part of council away and some of the reasons people apply due to the unique rp of it, prefects as a branch of council could perhaps be better. Relating to people in chat, the prefect role is quite immature, some of them a few days after being implemented have had faculty reports and already 2+ detentions (the threshold is 3) therefore I think the prefect role isn't suited for the responsibilities of what the council do.
 
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